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A proposal for Darwinia

They way we see that is not the point. The point is what Darwinia pretend to be. If they wish to attract new talent with the opportunity (candy) to get invested soon (if they perform well), Darwinia is falling short. If the only way a darwin can achieve AUM from Darwinia is having an outstanding month…you are not looking for quality promising traders, you are trying to bring amount of hungry short term traders that after a while will be frustrated. Then you are bringing farmers and low quality migration accounts…tell me that I am wrong.

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I agree on this but the solution is to stop migrations, not to change EX or Darwinia.

Why stop migrations? No, I think this is good for Darwinex and good for investors. What I agree is to put all migrations on a quarantine period of 4-6 months before they have any right to compete for Darwinia or private investors money. Quality migrations are good.

I imagine Darwinia like a quarry of a football club. You have your best talents there motivated, and those will be your best traders in future. But you have to educated them thinking in long term while you are rewarding them when they do a good job, so removing EX and averaging last months to make them win a prize should be a good approach.

It looks like you think from your personal perspective, you don´t want migrations (they compete with you at all levels), and you don´t want to give to new or young darwins an equal opportunity to compete in Darwinia because the will compete with your old darwins too. I see a selfish and biassed thinking here. My thoughts are neutral and focused on the general well, some of them are against my own interests.

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As you pointed out lately my darwins are not so competitive, but migrations are stealing AUM to darwins much better than mine, with trackrecords longer than mine, like WFJ PLF NTI UYZ …
Not just words, I am investing these darwins in my portfolio…

That´s exactly my point. Your darwins will be more competitive with less competititors! :smirk:

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Once there was an idea which could be improved to reward younger attractive Darwins

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When I posted that suggestion Darwinex wasn’t allocating 80 darwins per month.
At the beginning they were allocating 20, then 40, then 60 and now 80 .
If you consider the “latest” filter 30-40 new darwins are created every week so it seems that Darwinex is attractive despite EX and despite equity rules.
As investor I want quality over quantity, I want darwins that last and do not give up.
I would prefer a longer allocation than a larger population of allocated darwins.

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Darwinex, if you are looking for iron man or marathon man traders, don´t reward sprinters at Darwinia contest (even worst if they are only old sprinters with 10 EX).
Start doing things properly since the begining, make new rules as if Darwinia was a quarry of a football team, because Darwinia should be your future.

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From the DarwinIA page:

DarwinIA is our monthly trading challenge, which distributes a maximum of €5,000,000 of Darwinex’s notional capital between the best 80 DARWINs of the month.

If this is the DarwinIA “mission statement”, then I would have to agree with @Forexintradiadarwin that Ex is too heavily weighted for DarwinIA scoring purposes, and it should be equalized between 10 Ex Darwins and 1 Ex Darwins, because looking over the last month, there may have been a Darwin with D-score 20 that performed a lot better than a Darwin with a D-score of 70.

I would suggest to set Ex = 0 on the first day of the “Regularity look-back period” and start counting from that day. You would still see an Ex difference between Darwins that made lots of trade decisions in the last 3 months vs Darwins that didn’t. This encourages/enables Darwin providers to be competitive in DarwinIA even with a track record as short as 3 months, while it would still be attractive for good traders with long track records to migrate from a different broker to Darwinex.

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What’s the point to allocate a “forward test” of 3 months.
People complain that Darwinia allocates lucky darwins, at least a long trackrecord is persistence+luck, that is better than just luck.

Darwinia has to foster persistence, if you foster short trackrecords we will have a ton of new useless darwins per week.

Darwinia is an automated investor and should work as an investor, holding the allocation for one year would be also inspiring for investors while investing short trackrecords is a mistake 99% of times.

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True, but a little encouragement along the way may make a big difference to retain the persistent traders from their beginnings. I don’t know… Maybe from my own point of view as a Low Ex Darwin provider that tries to do well, it feels worse to be ranked below Darwins just because they exist longer than mine, compared to being ranked below Darwins that actually performed better than mine over the last month. I’m entirely aware that that feeling will probably change once I get to 10 Ex though :smiley:

Besides, one lucky month only gives you allocations. After that, the trader is (or at least should be) motivated to keep doing well for 3 months in a row to actually get the first batch of fees associated with the allocation.

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EX 10 can be achieved in a few months’ trading if you have certain trading frequency level, so not that hard to get to it.

I can’t speak of Darwinia or other people, but only for myself who also has some fund investing here, I would definately think twice seeing short record darwins with less than 1.5 year of record no matter how fancy its equity curve is, and the ones with only a few trades done, and young (around one year) darwins are already having good chances being allocated big amount of prizes(as I have seen many occasions that Darwins that I will never invest myself get big allocations here).

In that sense, young darwins are already treated more than fairly here, look at the each month’s Darwinia ranking, would u invest even half of them yoruself as an investor?

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True good and long term surviving stuff needs at least a year to review, so extend allocation to 1 year is good point.

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Discipline, persistence, patience, adaptability, mental toughness, etc…are qualities of every good trader, but I am sorry these don´t give traders neither investors any money.
What give everybody money is performance, profits…So, it is fine to applaud disciplined and persistent traders (but it is just something that every trader is supposed to have, like you assume a professional sportman is in good physical shape). But what you pursue are results, and performance…then reward performance. While you don´t understand this concept, you´ll fail in any field, that´s guaranted.
So, Darwinia can be a good environment to make good traders (if some changes are implemented), or Darwinex will have some persistent traders which eventually will get some prices, but will never get the achievements that are supposed to reach.
Only the time will say who was right (I know I am right because I have implemented these principles serveral times in my life).
And, don´t ge me wrong, all those qualities are vital to be a good trader, but those without the performance are nothing. I know many people having those qualities, but they never reach their dreams because they don´t focus on the objetive, they just fight and fight and fight without a direction…you get what you are focus at.

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Trading is not a sport, in sport you have some luck but not the same degree of randomness of markets.
In trading and with markets in general short term performance is almost always luck, the only way to separate skill from luck is a big sample, many trades and many months.

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I totally disagree with that statements. I know you are wrong, and I know I can´t change you, but time probably will…(I hope it really happens for your well). Good trading Cavaliere, you have many qualities to be a good trader, just focus on the goals instead on the qualites (I am not being cocky, believe me. I´ve just passed through many battles, and I know the way better than many out there).

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I’d claim that at least the mindset of a pro athlete and a successful trader have to be very similar.

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I disagree with changing darwinia without taking in account the Ex, and I support @CavaliereVerde.

And colleagues that meet me 2-3 years ago, know that I always understood the concept of significance that is included in this IA, though I had to wait almost 3 years to get the fully experience of the darwins.

Then I mean that my opinion has to be considered objective, and not trying to take advantage of the current position:

  1. some are confussing older darwins with significant darwins (less than 12 dperiod implies no significance).

  2. in darwinia it is not valued directly the Ex, it is valued the dscore.

  3. in dscore weights a lot the performance… Without good results, there is not high performance, and no way to darwinia without a very good month

  4. maintaining the monthly darwinia, without filtering for dscore, it would be a big lottery

I agree with proposals as increase the period of allocation to 1 year, reduce the weight of the monthly activity or increase the period of evaluation to 3M to reduce the possibilities of lucky monthly darwins.

It is not a question of ex, it is a question of dscore, and it is not new that darwinex lead to traders to improve the dscore with rebates and darwinia.

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3 posts were merged into an existing topic: Darwinia contest for cadets

This is from newest blog post on Darwinex new product.

It’s worth noting that the Private Label will not substitute the exchange model but will amplify it. It complements our current offering to independent managers.

1. Enjoy excellent execution
2. Train for managing investor capital through DarwinIA allocations
3. Opt for investor capital in the “jungle” of thousands of DARWINs
4. When time comes, create your brand and start selling your strategy to professional investors with the help of Darwinex and professional agents

This is nice discussion. Many ideas and suggestions. I used to object to changes in DarwinIA and also how Darwin Exchange has turned into ‘jungle’ with low quality investors who jump in and jump out form Darwins. Not anymore. Darwinex as a business has only so much resources for implementing changes. There have to be priorities. And from list of 4 objectives above it is very clear to me now.
Main objective is to look at this from a long term perspective.

You open account and then you want to scale by getting funded and stacking investment.
I see DarwinIA in current state as a stepping stone/transition from not being funded to getting some funds.
And if you are already serious trader with larger account and years of experience and aiming to generate full-time income from trading, then DarwinIA is not your priority at all. You jump right to the 3rd objective which is getting funded by investors.
But even this 3rd objective is only transition for most traders. Darwin Exchange is very competitive ‘jungle’ and not suited for advertising your own Darwin to larger investors. Only few Darwins are stacking reasonable investment out of almost 3000 Darwins.
Answer is 4th objective and that is Private Label and promoting your own fund to outside more sophisticated investors.

If you are trader either in the beginning of your journey or already few years ahead, then you should focus on long term objective and that is not DarwinIA. I think Darwinex is doing it and current DarwinIA looks like good enough for what it is suited for. I think traders should focus more on how to get past the DarwinIA and progress to larger goals than just trying to spend so much time and energy on trying to turn DarwinIA into some perfect product.
Yes, DarwinIA could be improved but in big scheme of things that may not be priority at the moment.

Traders who base their entire trading style with big risk just to profit from DarwinIA and have no long term objective to get serious investment in the future should not be our concern or competition here. For us traders who are serious enough to build trading into business bringing serious wealth, DarwinIA structure should not be our main concern.

Our concern should be how to structure our trading so it will be attractive enough for more sophisticated outside investors from long term objective and not how to squeeze as much money from DarwinIA as possible.

At least that’s how I am going to approach this from now on. From long term objective the majority of investment will not come from DarwinIA or from investors on Darwin Exchange but from selling your strategy to professional investors.

If you’re playing short term game, then keep trying to convince Darwinex to spend more resources on DarwinIA. I am not going to do that anymore. I’m looking forward to Private Label.

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